E-cigarettes?

[me]

Does anyone have experience with e-cigarettes? We were kinda thinking about getting an e-cigarette for my grandfather. He has a lung disease and should stop smoking but he won't. I read somewhere e-cigarettes were better for your health because it doesn't contain all the same toxins like normal cigarettes do. Any thoughts? Pros and cons?

[Aria]

I use mine infrequently, but come the end of the year, I'll be using it almost full-time for a while while I get off the actual nasty things.

I'm sorry to hear about your grandfather too, I know the worry it causes. Mine was just diagnosed with lung cancer, and is spending the net two weeks with us recieving radiation therapy (there is no plan to fight it....just to make him comfortable). He hadn't smoked in years, I don't even remember him smoking when I was little and he as still drinking, but I wouldn't be surprised it it caused the cancer.

But I digress...

As for E-cigs? It depends on the kind that you might feel would work best. You can get ones that look like actual cigarettes (and gosh, I want one!) Those I think have the advantage of being able to hold and give the visual and touch sensations (despite it not being paper...) and could probably help with the mental and psychological addiction.

The problem with mine, is that it's an Ego, and it kinda makes me feel like I'm using an electronic crack pipe, because I can't hold it the same as a cigarette, and it's much larger, heavier, and bulkier. It's also bright pink. But, it was a gift from a woman I just randomly met at a bar a while back who had a spare and had already quit for 3 months. No charge or anything, she just gave it to me, (including some remaining liquid) and all I had to do was get a replacement charger and coils for whenever it needed them changed.

Cons? They may not work for everyone. As said, I struggle with using it full-time and replacing it with cigarettes because to me, mine just "looks" weird, and nothing feels like an actual cigarette. Another con would be...several government-affiliated health agencies are tyring to scare the crap out of people with them and saying they have hidden dangers.

Here's the trick with that. They are nothing but a hookah with different ingrediants and liquid. The liquid? Is made up of the same stuff that is in smoke machines and the ingredients? The same as vanilla extract. Sans the flavors added, and the nicotine (but you can get ones without them). Companies are trying to have them "banned" due to their "harm". In Australia, it is strictly illegal to sell the e-liquids that contain the nicotine compound. The hypocrisy in that is that the government has jacked the price up of nicotine replacement therapy, which is actually MORE expensive than real cigs, and definitely more expensive than an e-cig kit.

So, if you're looking for something that is better on the budget, and doesn't need that much "topping up" with $120+ worth of "government approved" crap every couple of weeks, an e-cig is cheaper in the long run, and you really only need to buy replacement e-liquids once in a while...depending on how fast you go through it, and whether you're only buying one at a time. For instance.... I bought my charger, extra coils, and TWO liquids a year ago, for $60. That's about a week's worth of cigarettes for me...and a month's worth of NRT (patches, lozenges, inhalers, etc). I have yet to have to buy ANY replacements for it. Not even the liquid. A coil, can last you up to a MONTH and a bo of 6? costs about $8 (or it did for me...and Aussie prices are fucking stupid with *anything*).

An e-cig kit, you buy once. Of course, nothing last forever, you might need to replace the battery once every six months after you can no longer keep charging it. (I've yet to have to replace mine, though.) Depending on the brand and style you get, the battery size needed, the amount of coils it uses, and how often you use it; the drains the battery's charge and used up liquid.

Really, my ONLY qualms about my e-cig is that it doesn't look or feel like the "real deal" to me, but their ARE other brands out that mimic the "light", the look, and the shape and size. The other complaints is that even though what is being expelled as "water vapor" you STILL get told off for using the damn thing inside a building or a "smoke-free zone." Which is pretty damn stupid in clubs that have a smoke machine being used. A lot of THAT fear stems from the idea that "there's no proper evidence at this stage that it is "safer" than normal cigarettes and doesn't harm other people in the area." Which is just a load of bull, because one of the biggest corporations in the WORLD are tobacco companies, and they have the government in their pocket.

If you haven't seen it, check out the movie "The Insider", which is based on a true story, and true facts. It pretty much talks about how the governments "bail out" tobacco companies whenever their poor wittle feelings are hurt and they still want to make billions from slowly killing people.

The problem with e-cigs too, is that because of the "scare tactics" these false claims are doing, too many people are still wary of them, still hating on them, and oddly enough, trust them LESS than cigarettes. A single ciagrette contains 4000 chemicals. E-liquid? about 4. A measely FOUR, and it's made from ingrediants that we use in high volume for entertainment...and as a food additive when you want to bake mom a cake for her birthday. They've even tried to say that you could be "inhaling tiny metal pieces", which is impossible, because metal is too damn dense to float in the air. Especially by the means of a normal human being inhaling! It's just because the tobacco companies are feeling like they're going to lose money if everyone "switches" to the safe alternative. The bastards even get revenue from NRTs!

And quite frankly, I'd much rather brave their theories of "metal flakes" and "still causes" cancer than I would continue to inhale pesticides, rocket fuel, and god knows what else.

If you'd like, I'll try and look for a few brands that I know of to try and see if there's one you wouldn't mind your grandfather trying? Remember though, these machines/devices cost a bit if you buy a kit for the first time, BUT, the upkeep is sooooo much cheaper in the long run. You probably spend more money on coffee per week.

[GG102]

E-cigarettes

I have never smoked, but I went to a heath site and here's what the so-called experts at Cancer.Net said:

Electronic cigarettes, also known as e-cigarettes or vapor cigarettes, are battery-operated devices that resemble traditional cigarettes. However, instead of burning tobacco, they generally contain cartridges filled with nicotine and other chemicals. When the e-cigarette is used, the liquid chemicals in the cartridge are turned into a vapor or steam that is inhaled by the smoker.

E-cigarettes may contain harmful substances. However, the types or concentrations of chemicals, including nicotine, vary based on the brand. Because e-cigarettes have only been readily available in the United States since 2006, there is limited research on their health risks.

The FDA started regulating e-cigarettes on August 8, 2016 and has not approved e-cigarettes as a way to quit smoking. People with cancer who want to quit smoking should use evidence-based methods for quitting smoking.

[Aria]

Oct 4, 2016 13:38:20 GMT -5 GG102 said:

E-cigarettes

I have never smoked, but I went to a heath site and here's what the so-called experts at Cancer.Net said:

Electronic cigarettes, also known as e-cigarettes or vapor cigarettes, are battery-operated devices that resemble traditional cigarettes. However, instead of burning tobacco, they generally contain cartridges filled with nicotine and other chemicals. When the e-cigarette is used, the liquid chemicals in the cartridge are turned into a vapor or steam that is inhaled by the smoker.

E-cigarettes may contain harmful substances. However, the types or concentrations of chemicals, including nicotine, vary based on the brand. Because e-cigarettes have only been readily available in the United States since 2006, there is limited research on their health risks.

The FDA started regulating e-cigarettes on August 8, 2016 and has not approved e-cigarettes as a way to quit smoking. People with cancer who want to quit smoking should use evidence-based methods for quitting smoking.

And that's what I mentioned above in my post. Heh.

If they're so worried about the chemicals used in them, why do they allow smoke machines and vanilla extract to be sold and used everyday? Heck, as a kid, we used to have pancakes once or twice a week and it was the ingredient that gave them a kick in flavor. Lol. It's the same stuff. You have smoke machines being used at children's school dances, for crying out loud. The only difference is, you're inhaling nicotine (which is naturally found in some foods we consume.....like lettuce and potatoes).

Awesome freakin' job on staying away from the suicide machines, though! You're smarter than a lot of the global population...including myself.

Just be careful about the diatribe going on about e-cigs right now. Those who oppose them, are usually extremely bias and have a personal agenda. s I said, they are basically just a miniature hookah with a button and a battery. 

[Aria]

Adding this for giggles. I still love it.

[Aria]

Actually, this one might be more fitting for this discussion...

[me]

Wow, thanks you guys Aria and GG102!

I'm so lost when it comes to cigarettes, lol! I have never even tried smoking anything, lol.


And thanks Aria, I'd love to get some brand suggestions. My grandfather has COPD, so unfortunately he'll slowly be choking I guess. The only thing that could stop his disease from progressing is to stop smoking, but he has smoked his entire life so he won't stop. Because of his COPD, he's very tired and has a hard time walking outside to smoke, and the smell is absolutely horrible when he's smoking inside, so we thought an e-cig could be easier to use, and I think cheaper for him. I'm not sure how much he smokes per day, but a lot I think. So I guess he's just interested in the nicotine, rather than flavours etc. I don't think he'll mind the "feel" either, lol. I think we'll be a few that'll share the cost of this, so the price isn't that important. 

[me]

And Aria I'm so sorry to hear about your grandfather! Cancer is a bitch! I'm a bioscientist, and I've worked with cancer, well prostate cancer, the last 4 years during my studies, and it's a bit depressing to take all those courses because it feels like literally anything causes cancer these days! Anything from smoke to UV light, to food, to DNA replication going wrong... Most of the time it's something you have no control over that causes it.

[somnium]

From my personal experience, I used an e-cig to quit. Within a couple days my smoker's cough was gone, and I could breathe easier. Might still get cancer from the chemicals, but I think the vapor is better than the smoke for your lungs.

[cally]

I used to smoke only a few sometimes when I was younger and I quite from one day to another so I guess I never got the addiction, however, my father in law smokes soo much and got an e-cigarette but never worked for him :/ but to e-cigarette defense I think he never really wanted to stop smoking. By the way, I'm sorry 'bout your grandpa

[me]

Oct 5, 2016 6:06:09 GMT -5 cally said:

I used to smoke only a few sometimes when I was younger and I quite from one day to another so I guess I never got the addiction, however, my father in law smokes soo much and got an e-cigarette but never worked for him :/ but to e-cigarette defense I think he never really wanted to stop smoking. By the way, I'm sorry 'bout your grandpa

Thanx!
I've heard of people who bought an e-cig but then didn't like it. Not sure why, if it was the "feel" or if they didn't get the same nicotine level and satisfaction? I know there are different anounts of nicotine you can put in them. I just hope it'll work for my grandpa, that he can use it.

[cally]

What about e-cigarette plus nicotine patchs? Maybe 2 methods work better than one. Of course all of these things depends on the individual

[Aria]

Oct 5, 2016 18:42:10 GMT -5 cally said:

What about e-cigarette plus nicotine patchs? Maybe 2 methods work better than one. Of course all of these things depends on the individual

No no no no! That's dangerous!

My mom in one of her many attempts to quit, used a patch and then smoked while forgetting it was on, and she got incredibly sick from it. Nicotine poisoning it always a risk and it's a dangerous one. She's been smoke free for 8 years now with using the loenges, and then switching to an ordinary mint to replace those. She's recently given up on the mints now too and is doing fine - even with all the stress she's been under lately.

The amount of nicotine that they put in cigarettes and e-liquids are very small, but if you top it up with extra nicotine (especially with a patch, that's levels are usually higher) it elevates the levels to a dangerous amount and can make you extremely sick. A lot of patch brands actually state "do NOT smoke while wearing these patches." And that's the reason for it - not because they are just discouraging you from smoking. Lol.

I will agree, quitting even WITH nicotine support should be done when it's something you really want. It requires a bit of will-power, but the e-cigs kind of take a little bit of the edge off that most other things don't. As said, my issue is to do with the "look and feel", but there are brands that have tried to accommodate that.

This one for instance.

zoomecigs.com/real-deal-feel/?age-verified=ee5b1959b4#TheEcig

Heck, I might even dig deeper into my bank account and get one of these myself, they look amazing. Lol.

[cally]

Uhhh I didn't know that Aria thanks for telling me! I guess maybe that was why my father in law couldn't make it, at the same time he was chewing those gums to stop smoking ...

[Aria]

Different things work for different people, cally For my mom, it was the lozenges, and "playing with her keys" whenever her hands would get restless in missing the habit of holding one. She started smoking at 19, and after numerous attempts and dozens of different ways, she finally did it almost 30 years later. And she smoked like a train. She'd go through a 50g pouch of "roll-your-own" tobacco and two packets of 50 tailor-mades (the ones that are factory made and have the orange filter) every two days. Me? I go through a pouch of 25g every 4-5 days, depending on how much I sleep, or how stressed I've been.

She tried the inhaler (a poor early version of n e-cig that basically) is a saturated a cotton bud with nicotine in a plastic puffer looking thing and no smoke...like breathing in yuck-tasting air. She went to quit smoking groups, she went through the national Quit line, she tried using cellery sticks and carrot sticks as substitutes, patches, the works. Everything except the gum, because she can't stand gum in general so we all knew that wouldn't have worked. She went to a specific quit smoking group about 10 years ago, and quit two years later by using the lozenges.

For others, I know just them quitting cold turkey worked....some need a bit of help, and if e-cigs do that, it's FAR more of a better choice than inhaling 4000+ chemicals until you do actually quit. Especially when those chemicals are stuff like arsenic, cyanide, chemicals used in rocket fuel and pesticide... and stuff they use in battery acid! Yikes, just typing that makes me glad I'm giving up in December.

As I mentioned, nicotine is actually a NATURAL compound. It's found in natural foods we eat all the time. Potatoes, lettuce, and I think tomatoes and pumpkin too, if I remember right. Very very small amounts, but it's there. Cigarettes have a higher level in them, and patches have a higher level because they are slowly released into the blood stream over a period of time while wearing them and it's absorbed into the skin. So, mixing an NRT with another, or smoking cigarettes with an NRT, is giving you a double-dose, or sometimes even a triple into your body, which can be harmful. Obviously, you'd have to ingest a lot of nicotine containing foods for it to be harmful, because the levels are something like 00.1% of a gram. But NRTs and cigarettes, have about let's say...the equivalent of eating about 120 potatoes in the time it takes to have a smoke... which is about 3-10 minutes.